Reign of Christ

January25th

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When we say “pro life” what do we mean? Does the Bible teach that “life” begins at conception? Define “life”, then? Try to define “life” covenantally. Define it in terms of biology. Where does the soul come from?

The Pro Life movement attempts to exegete a few Bible passages like Jeremiah 1:5 “”Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.” But, wouldn’t we insist that, for Jeremiah this was true, but how do we get to Dick and Jane? Psalm 139.13 is usually invoked as well: “For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother’s womb.” This, of course, was true for David who wrote the psalm. But how can we get from that to me and you? And, after all, David and Jeremiah were covenant people. Maybe such does not apply to non-covenant, non-regenerate people. Even in the example of John the Baptist “leaping” in his mother’s womb (Lk 1.44), does this mean all babies are as alive as he was? Maybe John, a covenat person, simply had “life” of the covenant in him that recognized the message of the birth of Messiah. If we followed this line of reasoning, the Pro Life movement’s appeal to such Scriptures fall apart.

What would be the objection to the Calvinist doctrine of total depravity wherein David wrote, “Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me” (Psalm 51.5). Was Dick and Jane conceived in sin, too, from birth? Calvinists use this verse in the same way Pro Lifers use the above. The argument is basically, “if was true for them, it must be true for all.”

Another plank in Pro Life apologetics is called “the sanctity of life.” What life? Covenant life? Biological life? Does God view both as important? The “sanctity of life” doctrine is rooted in another doctrine called, “imago Dei” (image of God). Since all men were “in Adam” and Adam was made “in the image of God”, then it follows that each and every conceived child is connected to such a divine stamp in some way, and thus, “important” and “meaningful.” It is only from this religious conception that Pro Life gets its ammunition from. In Communism, whether Pol Pot, Idi Amin, Hitler (yes, Hitler was a Socialist), or Stalin and Lenin, “life” does not have such a meaning or doctrine, since there is no God. Life can be exterminated for the greater good of the Proletariat. And exterminate they did.

Sanger, founder of the NOW organization, believed in extermination as well. Herbert Spencer, that father of sociology, intellectually defended it. They had no doctrine of image of God, or sanctity of life or any other “religious” appeal.

So – what happens when we strip away the doctrine of the “image of God” as applied to all mankind – every individual – that came from Adam? Clearly, not all are made in God’s image. That only would apply to the “covenant people.” What happens when we seek to rigidly fix what we can infer from biblical passages to the “I” and “me” of the above passages? They apply only to Jeremiah and David. They don’t “apply” to me. I was not “knit together” in my mother’s womb. Now, logically, there is no invalid reason for inferring from “one” to “all.” If we are speaking of the “one” as a class: human beings. David was a human being. Human beings are knit together in their mother’s womb and fearfully and wonderfully made. But, if one did this, one has to accept Psalm 51.5, too. Samuel Frost was born in sin. So was Jason Bradfield.

We do this with Adam. Adam was “made in the image of God” – and some want to limit it to just that. Yet, Genesis 9.6 seems to extend that definition to all. The basis for the ethical stance against murder is just that: image of God. It is here that the Pro Life movement makes its entire case.

Ideas have consequences, and in this case, to sever “spiritual” from “physical” has implications, politically speaking.

Perhaps some may wish to argue that abortion is fine for the unregenerate. Let them slaughter their own children. At least they can do so in a safe environment instead of back alley abortions. At least they are monitored and healthy. After all, God’s people don’t have abortions – so, who are we to say, NO ONE can have abortions because of some “image of God” doctrine? Isn’t that just the regenerate trying to make EVERYONE (the unregenerate) follow some sort of religious doctrine? Is there really a sanctity to HUMAN LIFE? Is there some sort of sanctity to biology? Why? Did God “create” it? How? Does the Bible even say how? Maybe he was just talking about the covenant people and not the universe and all mankind. How could you apply what was meant for a specific people to all people?

Ideas have consequences……

About the Author: Sam

Completed a M.A. in Christian Studies and a M.A. in Religion from Whitefield Theological Seminary, Lakeland, Florida (with combined credits in Hebrew exegesis from Reformed Theological Seminary, Orlando, Florida - and in Greek exegesis from Church of God School of Theology, Cleveland, Tennessee). Author of Misplaced Hope, Exegetical Essays on the Resurrection of the Dead, and coauthor of House Divided: Bridging the Gap in Reformed Eschatology. Also edited A Student's Hebrew Primer for Whitefield Theological Seminary. Samuel M. Frost co-founded Reign of Christ Ministries, and has lectured extensively for over 8 years at Preterist conferences, including the Evangelical Theological Society conference. While ordained as Teaching Pastor by Christ Covenant Church in St. Petersburg, Florida (2002-2005) he helped host the popular debates between Don Preston and Thomas Ice (with Mark Hitchcock) and Don Preston and James B. Jordan. Samuel is widely regarded by many of his peers as being one of the foremost experts on prophecy, apocalypticism, and Preterist theology. Samuel Frost owns and operates his own business and resides in Florida with his wife Ann Marie, and his children, Janet, Jacob, Hunter, and Olivia.

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  • Sam
    I am Pro Life, no doubt. But, I am so based on the doctrine that All Mankind is created in the image of God (Gen. 9.6). It is upon this basis that Pro Life doctrine builds its case. If, as some Preterists are saying, Adam was not made in God's image (and all after him as well), then the foundation of the Pro Life argument fails.
  • Joe
    Haven't you ever read Exodus 21.22-25? If two men are fighting and one of them accidentally bumps into a pregnant woman, what does it say? The unborn baby is just as important to God as the person who is "alive" and fighting. This is not about what only applied to the Israelites but is was an example of God's righteousness. If anything happened to the unborn child, the same judgement was to be carried out on the "living" man who injured the unborn. Abortion is not justified whether it happens to a person under the covenant or not. As Christians, we must be examples to the world. As policy makers, we must represent the unborn children because we know of the world's ignorance. Many years ago, I prayed to the Lord regarding abortion, and yes he still answers prayers. He showed me a vision of a military battle field where many young soldiers were dying. He said "what would you do to save their lives if you were a doctor?" I said, I would do my best to save every life and work on the soldiers that had the greatest chance of survival. God said, "this is how I view abortion". Doctors should view unborn babies and mothers as living beings and always try to save the lives that have the greatest chance at survival. Doctors should make the choice (upholding their othe) the save the person with the greatest chance to survive. It is not a choice for mothers or fathers. Most likely (and statistically) the woman has a greater chance of survival over a baby. No mother has a right to murder her own child. Two wrongs do not make a right. Many bad things happen to all of us, but sometimes God just want to see how we will react. Will we return wrong for wrong OR choose to make a better choice to uphold God's righeousness and be blessed.
  • knoxtn_pret
    MoGrace2u...sorry about the typos...correction.....I see the problem....you are discussing things in specific and I am implying things in a big picture view....long story short, imho, we die not because of Adam's sin....we die by our own hand i.e....our own sin....kin regards...Jim



    Ezek 18:18-20



    18 "As for his father, because he practiced extortion, robbed his brother and did what was not good among his people, behold, he will die for his iniquity.



    19 "Yet you say, "Why should the son not bear the punishment for the father's iniquity?' When the son has practiced justice and righteousness and has observed all My statutes and done them, he shall surely live.



    20 "The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father's iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son's iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself.

    NASU
  • knoxtn_pret
    MoGrace2u...I see the problem....you are discussing things in specific and I am implying things in a big picture view....long story short, imho, we die not because of Adam's sign....we did by our own hand i.e....our own sin....kin regards...Jim

    Ezek 18:18-20

    18 "As for his father, because he practiced extortion, robbed his brother and did what was not good among his people, behold, he will die for his iniquity.

    19 "Yet you say, "Why should the son not bear the punishment for the father's iniquity?' When the son has practiced justice and righteousness and has observed all My statutes and done them, he shall surely live.

    20 "The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father's iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son's iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself.
    NASU
  • MoGrace2u
    Hmmm, King Amaziah slew the servants who killed his father but not their children because of the word of the Lord which he read. I don't see how this fits the abortion issue whereby the sin being committed which is killing a child is that of its mother.

    I suppose if other children are born to her that die after because of that sin you might have a point that God has killed her other children because of her sin. Which would then go against this word Amaziah let counsel his actions.

    Yet David was told by God that his son born of his adultery with Bathsheba would die because of his sin. Yet David is comforted knowing he will see him again. This exception comes because of who David is, and because the line to Messiah was not to be tainted by sin. God made an example of David in doing this.

    Comparing a scenario whereby a king anointed by God acts according to the word of God with a woman who seeks no such counsel to guide her actions doesn't seem equal at all.
  • knoxtn_pret
    hmmmm.....

    2 Chron 25:4
    4 However, he did not put their children to death, but did as it is written in the law in the book of Moses, which the LORD commanded, saying, "Fathers shall not be put to death for sons, nor sons be put to death for fathers, but each shall be put to death for his own sin."
    NAS

    kind regards....Jim
  • brandonbranes
    I'm also of the opinion that our Covenant children would be placed in the care of Adonai as opposed to unbelievers children.
  • MoGrace2u
    I was referring to how we tend to say that babies are born in innocence; but having done no wrong, does not make one 'innocent' and therefore qualified for salvation. All men born in Adam are under the curse of sin and death even though they had not sinned as he did. This is the status of every child whether in the womb or not, that is born without a knowledge of God. But for a child whose parents know the Lord, then there is a provision for their children - but none exists for the child of the unbeliever.

    And even though we have a few exceptions where David and Jeremiah saw their call by God was from the womb, making their births prophetic; that is not the norm.

  • derrell
    MoGrace......................."But the case of David pretty much proves my point. His son was alive and under the convenant which David's sons were under, and thus the blessings of their father were theirs as well. David prays for him while he is alive."

    Do you think Absolum (davids son) was under the covenant which david was under?

    Do you think David prayed for Absolum while he was still alive?

    Do you think Absolum shared/shares in the blessings of David?

    Just thinking out loud trying to consider what you have written.

    GODSDOZER
  • derrell
    :) Mograce,................"That is the real tragedy of the unbeliever's sin in which he not only brings condemnation upon himself but on his child WHO HAS DONE NO WRONG."......................................."I don't believe babies are born innocent".

    Maybe im just confused at your point. the two statements above seem to contradict one another.

    Lastly, faith is what has saved mankind no matter what covenant they may or may not have been under. Faith is a gift from God not from a covenant. How God deals with his creatures who are unable to understand/comprehend tennants of faith due to braindamage/mental retardation/stillborn/abortion is beyond me.


    Blessings
    GODSDOZER
  • hal1
    Robin: ..."his child who has done no wrong."

    Hal: So a human who has done no wrong is a sinner who perishes? Sin is transgression of the law. Has this unborn child, who has done no wrong, somehow transgressed the law in the womb? If he has done no wrong, he has not transgressed the law, and is therefore sinless. If he is a sinner in the womb, then he has somewho done wrong in the womb, transgressing the law in the womb. Was David in Ps.51 perhaps speaking hyperbolically, just as Paul was in Romans when he said he was the chief of sinners? Just some thoughts. Let each one be convinced in his/her own mind.
  • MoGrace2u
    Hi Derrell,
    But the case of David pretty much proves my point. His son was alive and under the convenant which David's sons were under, and thus the blessings of their father were theirs as well. David prays for him while he is alive.

    What unbeliever who chooses to kill their unborn child is consecrating that child with their prayers? That is the real tragedy of the unbeliever's sin in which he not only brings condemnation upon himself but on his child who has done no wrong.
  • derrell
    mograce, you stated.............""By giving that child no chance to live, he also has condemned him to hell, because of his own depraved selfishness."...............I don't believe babies are born innocent, because no one is born with a knowledge of God at all. And it is the parent's responsibility to raise up a child in the way he should go - which means we must teach them about God and what He requires.


    2 Sam.12.......Then David got up from the ground. After he had washed, put on lotions and changed his clothes, he went into the house of the LORD and worshiped. Then he went to his own house, and at his request they served him food, and he ate.

    21 His servants asked him, "Why are you acting this way? While the child was alive, you fasted and wept, but now that the child is dead, you get up and eat!"

    22 He answered, "While the child was still alive, I fasted and wept. I thought, 'Who knows? The LORD may be gracious to me and let the child live.' 23 But now that he is dead, why should I fast? Can I bring him back again? I will go to him, but he will not return to me."

    This text seems to suggest to me that David expected to see his son again when David died. Although his son would not be brought back to life, David seemed confident that he himself would go to the place of his dying son.

    I do not believe man can condem anyone to hell (someone who chooses abortion), that is Gods providence. No one is born innocent, yet God is full of grace and mercy.


    GODSDOZER
  • hal1
    That's awesome Jim! As a biologist, you may be blessed not onlyby Dr. Menton's DVD, but Dr. Geoffrey Simmons book "What Darwin Didn't Know." I know three highly educated men who told me they learned from and were edified by these resoureces: one has a double doctorate in Biology and Geology, one is an M.D. (a hand surgeon), and one is a college science teacher with a PhD in Education.

    Of course, those without graduate degrees who are interested in human anatomy and physiology will be doubly blessed by these great resources. What an exciting time we live in, when so much godly and truthful scientific information is available to Christians, to help combat all the long-debunked naturalistic macroevolutionary hypotheses that many of us (such as myself) were spoonfed growing up. It's a great time to be a Jesus follower!

    Blessings to you.

    -Hal
  • knoxtn_pret
    Hal1...

    I actually taught a course in human embryology back in the 1970s.....I taught at the HS level for 4 years....I also have a medical background as I used to run nuclear medicine labs....

    Kind regards...

    Jim
  • hal1
    Jim,

    I don't know if you or anyone else would be interested, but there is a really great little 60-minute DVD by anatomist Dr. David Menton entitled, "Fearfully and Wonderfully Made." It can be ordered if you go to the following link and scroll down towards to bottom of the page/end of the article: It dovetails on what you were writing about - the intracate design and "against all odds" mechanisms that are involved in every single birth (in fact in every single fertilization) is evidence of a guiding hand much greater than ourselves. To believe all these processes came about by blind, mechanistic, random chance over time....well, I simply do not have enough faith to be an unbeliever! :)

    http://www.dailyencouragement.net/archives/2009...
  • MoGrace2u
    Psa 68:20 - He that is our God is the God of salvation; and unto GOD the Lord belong the issues from death.

    If one is looking for a scriptural support for why one ought not to kill their own child, then it ought to be from this knowledge of condemnation that rests upon all men conceived in Adam. By giving that child no chance to live, he also has condemned him to hell, because of his own depraved selfishness.

    I don't believe babies are born innocent, because no one is born with a knowledge of God at all. And it is the parent's responsibility to raise up a child in the way he should go - which means we must teach them about God and what He requires.

    Nor do I believe that abortion is a sin that cannot be forgiven and covered with the blood of Christ. But I also believe that once coming to faith in Christ that our children are covered. If the cross works both backward and forward in time, then as believers all our past sins are covered. But what hope can you give the unregenerate for their aborted child other that to put their trust in Christ?

    No one comes to the Father, but by Me...
  • Jim Nicolosi
    ...interesting commentary....I am a biologist by training and studied embryology in my courses....though I was not a believer in the biblical sense at the time, I was impressed with intricate development that occured in the embryo....we truly are fearfully and wonderfully made...I concluded at the time that there was a God and He was intimately involved in the development of a baby...the right to lifers may be biblically misgiuided but they defend those who cannot defend themselves....kind regards...Jim...Knoxville, TN
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